Vinyl plank is intended to be joined together using techniques such as click and lock and glue down. If you wish to install vinyl planks on a concrete surface, you must first determine the quality of the surface. Before beginning the installation process, you need to ensure that your sub-floor is in excellent condition, including smoothness, cleanliness, dust-freeness, and damage-freeness. The most frequently asked question is whether or not underlayment is required for vinyl plank flooring.
In the case of concrete floors, an underlayment is required for the sub-flooring to be installed. Because of the underlay, your floor will be softer and more cushioned, and its insulating properties will grow, keeping your floor warm even throughout the winter. If you have previous expertise installing flooring or are a DIY enthusiast, laying vinyl plank flooring on concrete should not take you more than a day. It is one of the most affordable options available, and at the time of writing, it might cost you as little as a few hundred dollars, depending on the size of the area you are trying to cover.
Is it necessary to install a subfloor beneath vinyl plank flooring? If you are installing vinyl plank flooring on concrete, you already have a subfloor in place, according to the rules. Some folks, on the other hand, choose to place an additional thin layer of subflooring between the concrete and the vinyl.
This additional layer may increase insulation, causing your vinyl plank flooring to become warmer and less resonant. Adding an extra layer of concrete can help to even out minor irregularities in the concrete or to level it out if the concrete has dropped or sunk in some spots. The most important thing is that the concrete is smooth, devoid of flaws, clean, and dust-free and that there are no cracks.
Vinyl plank flooring is water-resistant, and if it has a WPC core, it is waterproof, so it will not be harmed by moisture. Mold and mildew, on the other hand, will grow underneath it, which might lead to health problems in the future. Over time, excess moisture will weaken the adhesive used to install glue-down board flooring, resulting in lifting. When it comes to glue-together and glue-down floors, the weight ranges between 8 and 12 pounds, so be sure to check the moisture requirements for the product you intend to purchase.
If the concrete has high places, you must grind them down, and if it has low spots or cracks, you must fix them with a concrete patching compound before installing the flooring. Installing a thermal underlayment, preferably composed of cork, fiber-felt, or a similar substance, beneath a floating vinyl floor on the concrete is perhaps the most straightforward technique to improve the insulation of the floor.
Plastic sheeting is simple to install, and it will not add much to the overall duration or cost of the project. Alternatively, if you want to attain the highest level of comfort, you can install a plywood subfloor on sleeper joists or install a subflooring system such as DRICORE tiles.
Wi t h this method, moisture from a below-grade subfloor can be dissipated while the floor covering remains separate from the concrete surface. If you add insulation between the joists before laying the plywood, it will make the floor feel warmer.
Due to the fact that this sort of subfloor raises the final floor significantly in height, it may cause issues around doors and transitions to other floors, so careful consideration should be given to this. As long as the subfloor is dry and you use a product with a strong backing and core, you can safely forego the usage of an underlayment. Always follow the installation instructions provided by the flooring manufacturer when installing over concrete.
Baseboards are typically removed before installing a floating floor and reinstalled subsequently, but if this is not possible, quarter-round molding should be attached to the existing baseboards once the flooring has been installed. To be certain, measure the size of the floor in square feet, multiply the result by ten percent, divide the result by the number of square feet in a box, and purchase the appropriate number of boxes.
When the new flooring is delivered, open the boxes and scatter the planks around the installation area for at least 48 hours to allow them to become acclimated to the environment. Choose the wall along which you want to place the first row of tiles and then use a tape measure to measure the width of the space at both ends of the room.
My kitchen tiles became loose one by one. I lift the wonder-board and I see a straight crack. What could be the reason? So, that tells me that there is no mortar underneath the cement board which could be the cause of your loose tile issue. If you want to use tap cons and install them per the fastener schedule then maybe that will work.
Great forum thanks a lot. I am getting ready to install tile in a small upstairs bathroom. I first poured self leveling concrete to make up for a substantial slope, I then cut Hardi backer which I will install with thin set underneath and finally screw down the Hardi backer through the self leveling concrete and into the plywood sub floor. Does this seem like an ok idea or do I need to scrap the Hardi backer for a different product over the floor leveler?
Thanks a lot, Jon. First thing, is I would check if you installed the correct leveler. There are only certain levelers that are approved for going over wood substrates and one of those types would need to be installed.
Alternatively, some levelers require metal lath to be installed over a wood subfloor prior to installing the leveler. If you wanted to install cement board then that should have been installed first thing and directly over the wood subfloor. I am in the process of installing a new ceramic tile floor over hydronic viega radiant heat.
I will use the viega climate panel, which the pex tubing snaps into. The viega installation instructions say to glue and screw the backer hardie board down. Your suggestion is to use thinset and screws. What method should be used and if it is glue, what type? Or if thinset, what type issued over the pex tubing? Thanks for any information. Can you put thinset mortar on OSB subfloor? This is not advantech OSB just the Lowes cheap stuff.
It depends on what you are installing. If you are installing cement board or an uncoupling membrane then, yes, you would thinset those down and sometimes to OSB. What is it that you want to stick to the OSB with the thinset? Appreciate this page. I have 1 inch thick by 4 inch wide pine boards, with no subfloor underneath. The boards fasten right to the beams underneath, thus removing them is not really an option I believe.
They are solid as only about 10 years old, but not tongue and groove so not super tight in all spots.
I have a feeling I need to use plywood above before I put down thinset and backer board but want to confirm that. I understand that the backer board does not add structural strength, but do I really need that if the floor itself is strong? My home has OSB as a subfloor like alot of homes now.
Is it safe to say that I can treat it like a plywood subfloor and place mortar, cement board, mortar then tile or is it not even worth doing with having OSB? At least not yet. The other advantage of this is that it keeps the overall height of the floor down. Cement board is a great way of going over OSB and the way that you outlined should work perfectly. Additionally, it helps if you can scrape, or sand, the surface to promote adhesion.
If anything happens then the particle board will swell and ruin the tile. You can rent a toe kick saw if you need to get under the cabinets. Link to instagram video about removing vinyl subfloor. You can also install backer board, like you mentioned, but then the floor height is going to be a lot higher than it currently is and you could have issues with door heights, etc. Thank you for a great forum. I am replacing 20 year old 8X8 ceramic tiles in our 80 sqft kitchen installed on gypsum.
When I removed the old tiles and gypsum, OSB board revealed random spots of dried mold especially under the refrigerator. Apparently the refrigerator had small leaks over the years but the compressor heat evaporated the water while causing minor mold therefore we did not have any extensive smell of the mold.
Since I had a hip fracture 2 years ago, doing floor work was extremely difficult and expensive especially thin-setting multiple times between layers of the underlayments. I experimented laying DITRA first under the sink cabinet 4 sqft area and realized that 80 sqft will be a huge pain. However, my enthusiasm has been curbed when I read Hardibacker installation instructions and your recommendations that I still need to have thinset under the cement board.
That means I am back to where I am with thinset mess and pain and more expense. Second question is, Hardibacker is not waterproof unless I use Hardibacker Hydrodefense for Walls. Can I use Hardibacker Hydrodefense for floors? For me waterproofing and protecting 20 year old OSB from mold is more important. Really appreciate your advice. It sounds like you need to come up 1 inch with the underlayment. I think the best way to go would be to add plywood over the floor as it is right now.
You would have to check with the manufacturer to see if mortar underneath Hardibacker is necessary. I know Hardibacker wants mortar underneath but they are also assuming that you will be installing tile with a mortar adhesive. You can waterproof over the Hardibacker on a floor if you want.
Also, on one side of the tub against the wall they installed green board. At the back of the tub there is the Hardibacker where it joins into the open shower. I had thought to put Redguard over that section which will not receive a lot of water. Am I cool? Or should I demand it be cut to the height of the tile installation and hardibacker installed. The shower is separate from the tub. Either thickness of Hardibacker works just fine over a floor. IUsing thinset under cement board depends on your subfloor.
Over plywood I agree.. They spray a wax waterproofing on the floor. Thinset will not bond to it. Most new houses have advantic in them. You have to sand the whole floor down.. It usually dry before that and you can tell by the color change of the mortar. We put the cement board smooth side out, because for reason reason I had it in my head that thin-set was a mastic and not mortar.
Am I doomed if I use thin-set on the smooth side? I have a laundry room that had a laminate sheet flooring in it. I removed the laminate to find they had put down 3 layers of it glued in various places. It all looks to be the same so I guess it was done at the same time. I finally got this up and find the glue is not coming up.
Can I use a cement board to give me a clean level surface to lay my tile on? However, if you have a wood subfloor then you may not be down as far as you need to be.
Typically, the flooring is over an underlayment that is on top of the subfloor. That underlayment should come out as well. It is on a concrete floor. As I said I am down to just the remaining glue. It is hard and not coming up. I talked with a contractor and he said we could do the backer board or a leveling compound. Not sure what to do as I now have a cement floor with the glue remanence on it. You could use a foam board like Wedi or a leveling compound.
The best way to get rid of the glue is to grind it off with an electric grinder and a diamond cup wheel. Alternatively, you could prime over it with a product like Mapei Eco Prim Grip and then use a leveler or even adhere tile directly to that. I hope I have enough information to make an answer possible.
We are renovating the mudroom and lav of our home. I have a contractor, but was expecting to lay tile ourselves. The contractor has removed the previous tiles, which have been cracking. If I understand correctly, they had been set over vinyl flooring with no cement board. In general, though, I trust him. Do I need to find another flooring material?
Should I limit myself to significantly smaller, or even mosaic, tiles? They are trying to tell you the best way to install them. What about door swings? Bluestone is very thick and heavy, probably has some variance in the thickness of the product, and is going to be difficult to cut and install. If you do decide to move forward with the bluestone installation, I would recommend getting a professional installer. Hi there! I have removed all the vinyl flooring in the bathroom but there is quite a bit of old black adhesive which has been almost impossible to remove.
Is that something I can leave and cover with thinset or do I need to use a self leveling product? I have a bathroom floor to tile. I am told that the 5mm underlayment is luan plywood. The thin set bags I have seen at the big box store say not to use on luan plywood.
Do I need to replace the luan with an exterior plywood or is there a thinset available for use on luan? Unfortunately, the black adhesive probably contains asbestos so caution needs to be taken when this is encountered.
These can be painted over the cutback adhesive. Then you can proceed with Hardibacker or whatever underlayment that you are going to use on your floor.
Unfortunately, the luan plywood needs to be removed and replaced with an exterior plywood with a face grade of ACX. Can I put cabinets over cement board right away or do I have to let it dry just want my sink hooked up as soon as possible. I was considering using DryPly coated plywood under my HardiBoard installation. Am I correct in assuming this is OK as the adhesion of the thinsett to the plywood is not necessary? Treated lumber has high moisture content and warps when it dries out.
This product looks like it falls into this category. What is recommended is exterior grade ACX plywood. Hello, My husband and I just installed hardiebacker last night over two layers of super thick plywood. We used thinset under the boards, the proper screws, meshtaped the seams, and all boards were cut to meet properly. The only thing I can think of is that maybe the thinset was too thin.
The screws were installed deep and evenly. You might try tapping on the Hardibacker with a hammer handle, or something, and see if it sounds hollow in some spots. The floor is very sturdy and no bounce. My intention is to replace the hearth with brick veneer, so my question is, is it alright to place cement board right over the second subfloor and brick on that, or should I install ply first then backer board and brick?
The right way is probably to install the plywood first and then the cement board. You might check with the people at Hardibacker and see what they recommend. The landlord is making repairs from afar using a contractor who did not stagger all of the seams in the kitchen. Now we get to see if he uses mesh tape and thinset. The long not-staggered seam was actually the 3rd thing I noticed.
There are style choices being made in the renovation which are negatively affecting my color pallet and pattern choices giving me stress but the foundation issues are worth fighting for. Meaning, I can look down and see the ground. Such a narrow strip.
Seems like he is putting the pieces on the edge in structural jeopardy. I really hope not. I am trying to figure out if any of this is worth speaking up about. Thanks for the article. I am having my two upstairs bathrooms in a home remodeled.
The contractor mentioned he would put down thinnest and cement board on the floor before laying the tiles. I did ask if lose or weak plywood needs replacing as one piece when you step it dips down. He said no as the cement board will solve it.
Should the plywood be replaced? The hole where you can see the ground should obviously be patched or filled with something. Additionally, mesh tape and mortar would help to strengthen the thin piece of backer board. If the floor is in need of extensive surface preparation or repair, be prepared to add at least another day or two to the schedule.
See Concrete Surface Preparation. Here are the key factors influencing the installation of a decorative concrete floor:. In a new home or building with newly placed concrete floors, the concrete will need to cure completely before a decorative treatment can be applied generally after seven days or longer. The timeline for applying a basic decorative concrete floor can differ greatly from job to job. Harris classifies a basic application as one that's not overly intricate, with no sawcuts, no stencils, and with just one color covered by a sealer or wax finish.
Considerations include:. The timeline for installing a high-end decorative treatment can be significantly longer than a basic installation. Harris defines high-end floors as those with graphics, decorative sawcuts, borders, stenciling and the use of three or four colors, possibly combining stains and dyes. Considerations include crew size and skill level, project size and the condition of the floor.
Harris stresses that it's critical on a high-end project for the floor to be in great shape, which may necessitate grinding, acid etching or overlaying the floor to create a clean canvas.
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